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Re: logging, fact and fiction

daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Mon May 23 22:03:29 1994 )

Date: Mon, 23 May 1994 18:51:12 -0700
From: rayn@q.crossaccess.com (Ray Nawara jr.)
To: coldstuff@MIT.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199405240118.SAA21937@netcom.com> (deforest@netcom.com)

The reason turning off log scares me more than object creation is
because the log can be you ONLY warning that you've ben hacked. As in
the example I gave, where said nefarious hacker hacks an admin
account, turns off the log, makes another admin, and turns back on the
log. But as I've said, muds aren't the usual domain for hacking this
subtle. I'm jsut being paranoid. If log couldnt be turned off bt
admin, i could have a security program outside the server watching the
log for new admins, and if it got one, it would kill the
server. etc. I think your seriouly underestimating the importance of a
log in anti-hacking methods. But then again, I'm seriouly exaggerating
the danger of hackers on ColdMUD, so i guess were even :)

Can't an admin eval as $sys?

> I also hopes this explains why I wasn't worried about moving time
> in-db. If someone gets far enough along to screw up $sys.log then
> having log() only log strings will not make a bit of difference.

Only if they are not suble, and you are not careful :) sure they can
wipe out your db, and then youll reinstall from backup, and probably
look in where? the log file! to see how they hacked in. What, though,
if they dont wipe out your db. what if they do as i described above,
and get write access to sys via legitamate means? what if said hacker
is in the same lab as an admin, who leaves the terminal for a moment?
they wouldnt even need a password then, just enough time and knowledge
to turn off the log and make a new admin, and turn the log back on. 

But as I've said, this is mostly an issue dredged from my inner
paranoia's, and if you let me, i will argue forever.

Thanks to Crag for the explanation, and thanks to Lynx for the time
mod, and thanks to eveyone else to just because :)

	Ray / Ash